By the way, the IRS is supposed to guard against political groups posing as something they’re not


Ezra Klein and Evan Soltas make a few good points HERE:

Let’s try to keep two things in mind simultaneously: The IRS does need some kind of test that helps them weed out political organizations attempting to register as tax-exempt 501(c)4 social welfare groups. But that test has to be studiously, unquestionably neutral.

The story thus far seems both chilling and cheering. Employees at the agency’s Cincinnati branch did employ a test that, in effect, targeted tea party groups. Whether they meant it to be discriminatory or they simply created one that was discriminatory is in contention, but ultimately immaterial. The IRS, more so than almost any other agency, must act in ways above reproach.


It is worth remembering an important fact here: The IRS is supposed to reject groups that are primarily political from registering as 501(c)4s. If they’re going to do that, then they need some kind of test that helps them flag problematic applicants. And that test will have to be a bit impressionistic. It will mean taking the political rhetoric of the moment and watching for it in applications. It will require digging into the finances and activities of groups on the left and the right that seem to be political even as they’re promising their activities are primarily non-political.



  1. expdoc

    Would that include asking for lists of donors to an organization?

  2. Robert

    Nothing is sacred in todays world of warrantless wiretaps, business to business snooping and retaliation by govt agencies against detractors.. That’s why they call it The Information Age. But of course, it’s all about protecting the American people. Our country has defined terrorism so broadly that investigative agencies can use any activity as a basis to snoop.

    By the way, all new cars since I believe 2006 or 2008, have GPS tracking ability and some if not all have 2 way radio (onStar) although it may not be turned on (or atleast that’s what the owners may think). Some of the new Smart TV’s have built in cameras so the owner can use a gesture to signal the tv. One way or another Big Gubmint going to enter your homes. People think the Patriot Act and all the other Acts, Presidential Signing Statements, Executive Orders regarding intelligence gathering, is about catching terrorists. It’s about keeping on eye on the proletariat. Most of us fit into that class.


    Workers or working-class people, regarded collectively (often used with reference to Marxism).
    The lowest class of citizens in ancient Rome.


  3. Robert

    Whether or not any of you all want to believe it, posting on blog’s like Applesauce has its intelligence gathering side to it too. Do you think the NSA and FBI don’t look at these to see what the American people are thinking and if there’s any radicals amongst us? We all have files now. Same goes for Facebook, probably the most blatant intelligence gathering tool of all.

  4. Robert: You’ve stumbled on the truth. The government pays me to publish blog posts that will smoke out dangerous right-wingers.

    Have you ever noticed that some of the looniest wingnuts who have commented here have suddenly disappeared from our threads after months of prolific output?

    Yeah, it’s a nasty job, but somebody has to do it. At least I can take pride in serving my country.

  5. Robert

    Patrick, on a similar note, the rightwingers have said many times regarding the gathering of information, if you’re not doing anything wrong, they why do you care? Why do they care if a list of gun owners is created by the government is they’re not doing anything wrong? I think they’re beginning to figure out they might be the ones info is being gathered on. That changes their perspective then. Its ok to gather info on people they don’t like but if it’s on them, then its time rebel in the face of an ever intrusive government. Especially when its a Democrat in charge.

  6. Robert: Some folks dream of taking up arms against the government, which they think would lend meaning to their humdrum lives and validate their manhood. It’s all so pathetic.

  7. expdoc


    I tried really hard to muster a laugh at your last comment, but I just couldn’t do it.

    It does kind of shed new light on the long running battle on this site about the value of anonymous posting though doesn’t it?

  8. Craig Knauss


    What is really pathetic about the folks that dream of overthrowing the government is that most of them are nothing but chickenhawks. They never had any manhood to validate.

  9. Robert

    I’m back. Had to take a nap. My youthful exuberance isn’t what it used to be. As far as expdoc’s belief that his post are anonymous, your identity is easily obtainable and without a warrant, should some intelligence gathering government entity ever become curious about you. Even Yahoo acknowledges that people who post on their boards are not anonymous and can be tracked by their IP address. Everything we do on the internet is tracked and archived.

    A friend of mine plays this internet game that requires a camera be fixated on you so can move the players with your hand gestures. He told me the images captured are owned by that company. Do you think that camera is just capturing his hand gestures? It’s capturing whatever parts of his body (whole) and surrounding furnishings of his room. Technology is now that invasive and people gladly sign away their privacy to be entertained. Hope I’m not spooking too many people, but it should be very apparent we aren’t anonymous people anymore. We’re all kind of actors now, maybe that’s why they call it reality tv, because on a daily basis our image is captured on some video cam on average about 80 times a day, and that was the average figure a few years back that I read. Those brothers in Boston obviously had no idea they were going to be caught because their image was tracked as they dropped their knapsacks. The new technologies have their merit, but just remember there are very few private moments anymore. So put on a nice face because you never know who’s watching.

    Something else people don’t realize but it should be as obvious as daylight, every time you enter your account numbers into your phone when your accessing your various accounts (mostly banks employ this kind of access), all the numbers you enter into your phone are tracked and archived by the phone service you use, so that means the phone number for the bank and all the prompts you push as well as account ID and pin code.

    I never use that feature and opt to talk to an operator, but even then, all our calls are recorded. Every call in America is recorded. It doesn’t mean someone is listening, but should you be deemed a threat, all the NSA or FBI has to do is put a person in place to listen to your file, and voila, that anonymous phone call you thought you were having isn’t anymore. There is no privacy anymore. None. We all have electronic footprints now. That’s why the new electronic gadgets are called SMART this and that. SMART phone, Smart TV’s and how about Comcast’s Smartzone…

    I’m surprised lawyers aren’t more upset about this, but most don’t even realize the level of invasion of privacy that is occuring. Just think when the time comes that confidential lawyer/client call recording are hacked into and case information is garnered that the other side could use to win their case.

    And to think conservatives ever thought, if you’re not doing anything wrong, what do you have to hide. I’d say there’s plenty out there that people wouldn’t willingly express if they knew it was being recorded. Of course it only matters if you become the target of an investigation. But then with hackers being so creative these days, how does a person know where there private information might end up. That’s the world we live in. Have a nice day.

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