Heartland Community Church has eliminated 17 percent of its staff, despite a summer fundraising campaign that came within 80 percent of its goal.
The “Red to Black” campaign among the church membership raised $1.2 million of the $1.5 million it needed to regain sound financial footing. Mark Bankord, the church’s directional leader, said the campaign was “very successful,” but the church still needed to make staffing adjustments to bridge the gap.
“We all go through seasons where we have had to make hard decisions and manage expenses so you can pay the bills,” he said.
Seven full-time and 11 part-time employees lost their jobs this week, leaving the staff at 55 full-timers and 32 part-timers. Most of the cut employees were support staff, Bankord said, and were cut as the church eliminated some of its programming options.
Heartland owns and is a major tenant at Colonial Village Mall, a 368,000-square-foot property at 1280 Alpine Road. Bankord said the income from retailers and business tenants helps buoy the church’s finances, but the recession has taken its toll there, too, via vacant storefronts, including the loss of AMCORE Bank. The locally-owned company had a sizable business operations in the mall that was moved to Chicago when BMO Harris Bank took over in 2010.
Bankord said Heartland expanded its operations during the height of the Great Recession, adding staff to meet the growing needs of its congregation and the community. Now that the economy has stabilized, if not exactly recovered, the time has come to reassess its operations.
“We worked through those 20 percent unemployment seasons. As we look to come out of that, we’re looking to make sure we’re right-sized, fine tuned and doing things, in essence, we can afford to do,” he said.
Sean F. Driscoll on Insight
Who Owns Heartland Community Church? Is it a private Yacht Club or does it belong to the Members , the People who support, worship and attend Heartland. Stand Up and demand answer. Stand up in the middle of worship and demand answer right now. Let your Voices be Heard!!! Dont be emabraced. Stand up! Its your Chuch.
Eph 6:10-17 (NIV) …Be strong in the Lord and in his mighty power. Put on the full armour of God so that you can take your stand against the devil’s schemes. For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms. Therefore put on the full armour of God, so that when the day of evil comes, you may be able to stand your ground, and after you have done everything, to stand. Stand firm then, with the belt of truth buckled round your waist, with the breastplate of righteousness in place, and with your feet fitted with the readiness that comes from the gospel of peace. In addition to all this, take up the shield of faith, with which you can extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one. Take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.
AMEN!!!!
A 501c3 is a corporation created by and controlled by the state. It is a business that is beholden only to business. Nothing more and nothing less. Arguments about individual’s religious ethics within the corporation(s) are completely irrelevant. Yes, the truth will set you free, but oftentimes it must first be painful.
We are the best evidence that Jesus is alive. Are you living and behaving in a way that makes Him clear to a watching world?
Two thoughts:
This red to black campaign has left us Heartlanders black and blue.
We got more of those $20,000 moving lights now than we had in January. If they multiply at night by themselves, that’s a good thing and we should start to sell them to others. If somebody on Heartland staff has a moving light crack addiction, that is a bad thing as they are breaking us. Also, we had two cameras in back and now we have three at $60,000 a pop. Sometimes less is more.
It’s incredible how embarrassed some of the staff is over the spending that everyone knows about but few talk about. They are fearful of saying something and being let go. Some of the vendors the church has dealt with are in a quandry about the thousands that are owed to them over the years and trying to collect. Now it’s making sense, Even if they did hit the target of $1.5 million there are companies and organizations that are owed a lot of money. That makes sense why the numbers don’t add up with staff and ministry cuts. Listen to the employees, volunteers, and people and companies that have done business with Heartland and you get a picture of what’s going on with the money. Some of the managers (I refuse to call them leaders) can tell employees and volunteers to be quiet as much as they like because of the potential “damage to the Bride of Christ, the church” but the actual damage was done with it’s laissez faire attitude about the resources they have. It’s poor money management all around that goes way beyond just being neglectful. Much of it seems intentional. I’m praying for accountability on the part of the money decisionmakers and the board. If any one on the board has the audacity to say they didn’t know about the spending habits, bills owed, and money manipulation then they should have. An outside audit needs to be done.
Just fyi those lights are not $20,000 they are less than half that amount I work in the lighting industry and most of the lights hanging up their retail for about $8,000. So abulk buy when they purchased the building puts them under that.
I think what Geesh had to say was right on and I appreciate it greatly. I think there’s much more to the MONVEE story than Mark has been transparent about…but that’s between him and God. But, Geesh is right, we are to be known by our love for each other.
Almost all of the staff that was cut was hired before Mr. Bankord’s “Great Recession” comment so anyone who has been around church for a while knows this. It’s obvious with the ministry cuts the real dollar amount for the actual indebtedeness of the church is a lot more. I asked some friends tonight after church about money owed to many businesses
that have submitted goods and services going years back and everyone says the same thing. Tens of thousands are owed if not more. It breaks my heart to hear how people are giving their last few dollars and then learn about the irresponsible spending with hotels, airfares, homes with in ground pools, mixing for profit and not for profit money, conflicts of interests with the board, and whatever shenanigans there is with Monvee. We have done many good things but it makes me sick about the internal mismanagement. There needs to be a change in the leadership of the church if anything can be salvaged at Heartland.
Disheartened people – Please don’t think badly about ALL churches. Human beings make up churches and human beings err. It doesn’t make a difference who they are. There are churches that are very transparent and open to everyone about what they do. Don’t stereotype all because of the sins of a few. We all need God in our lives especially for times like these. Remember, God is in control and it isn’t like He’s surprised by anything. There is a plan for all. There a lots of good churches that encourage us to love God, people, and life and try to be models for the Acts 2 church . We are praying for you.
Mark, I want you to go to meet Bob Tierney and discover his Heart of Hearts. He has an office at 3030 Finley Road, in Downers Grove, IL. Learn from and through him as much as you can. More divine guidance to come…
Jerold Raimer, this is scripture taken out of context at its finest. I don’t attend Heartland, but like you, I am a fellow believer. I had not intended on commenting but after reading many of these slanderous posts and finally coming to yours, it was hard to just sit by. I have no problem what-so-ever with comments of people desiring transparency with the finances. Comments that started to go after the Bankard family really made me ill. But to see your post, as a fellow believer is bewildering. The writer here (probably Paul, but who knows) is addressing the church of Ephesus to stand against the attacks of satan and to be aware of heretic rulers of that time. Mark Bankard, like all of us is not perfect, but to associate him (or anyone on the Heartland leadership team) with the “authorities of the dark world” is egregious and you should be ashamed to throw out such harsh slander. What about this shows loving your neighbor, especially christian brother, and choosing to believe the best in them that Jesus commands all throughout scripture?
As far as standing up in the service to demand answers. I am certainly no biblical expert, and have a lot to learn about God’s word and what it means to be a true Christ follower. But there is not a shred of biblical backed evidence to create dissension in your church body by interrupting a worship service. I’ll even say that again so you get the point. There is not a shred of biblical backed evidence to create dissension in your church body by interrupting a worship service. That is so unbiblical it breaks my heart that another believer would go on to a public website to offer this advice. We are given the example in Matthew how to handle confronting another person. Matt 18:15-17 “If another believer sins against you, go privately and point out the offense. if the person listens and confesses it, you have won that person back. But if you are unsuccessful, take one or two others with you and go back again, so that everything you say may be confirmed by two or three witnesses. If the person still refuses to listen, take your case to the church. Then if he or she won’t accept the church’s decision, treat that person as a pagan or a corrupt tax collector.” Even here, when bringing the church body into it, this is to be done outside of the worship service. Jesus is talking about correcting another believer here, and truthfully, we don’t have all the facts to know if they need to be corrected. Instead of offering terrible advice, and using the bible inappropriately to do it, you should be praying for your brothers and sisters at Heartland, including the Bankards and leadership, and ask that God would begin the restoration process for that church because they are making an impact for the kingdom of God.
After reading through all of the negative comments, I just feel the need to bring a different perspective to some things. Heartland is my church and I have been forever changed by the ministry that has happened there.
Mike Breaux teaches with authenticity and conviction and has helped me to see God’s love and to want to live a life that pleases and glorifies God.
Mark Bankord has lead boldly even in the face of opposition, taking a lot of arrows. Leadership is difficult, because you know that there will always be someone who is against you and thinks they could do it better. I have been challenged and lead to live differently because of Mark as well.
A few things to ponder:
1. The Bankord family all on paid staff… I guess I am not sure where the problem is. I, personally think this is a testament to the love of the church and ministry. I am proud of Mark and Sherri for raising kids that love thier church and want to spend their lives making a difference. In no other arena is this looked down upon… when an entire family runs a restaurant, funeral home, construction business… no one is up in arms that the family is all doing it together. It is seen as a family uniting under one passion and interest and we love to see it. But somehow when it is the Church we get all hot and bothered that a family likes doing ministry together. I would love to work with all of my family, and I would guess that you would too. Why not see this as something that is a huge positive and not some shady deal. ANd before you go thinking or saying that they are unqualified… have a conversation with them first.
2. Salaries… this is always so touchy because really, people want to make sure that no one is making too much more than them. But I think if the tables were turned, none of you would turn down a higher salary. I don’t know what the leadership at Heartland is paid, but to me, I think the higher the better. They are all leading an amazing place that loves the community, loves God, moves us as attenders towards change. I say pay them well. They could be doing a lot of other things and personally, I have no problem showing them honor with pay. And I do trust they they are also being generous with their resources, they said they are, so I believe it.
3. In regards to Red to Black… I am thankful for a church that will be as honest as they can be about a situation and ask for help. I am trusting that the leadership prayed processed over what the next steps had to be. I am incredibly sad for the job losses of the 18 employees, but I also know that none of us were there. None of us have the information that the leadership had, and we have no right to it. It is not our battle to fight, that is why we pay them to do it. The leadership has to spend their weeks trying to figure out to do with the budget deficit, and I am sure it weighed heavily on them, while we all slept soundly wondering what we would have for lunch the nex day. Just because they didn’t make the same decision you would make (even though you have VERY limited information) doesn’t warrant gossip and slander. I am again trusting.
4. Lastly, This is a church, and the leaders are in place. They had the courage to start it, and they get the priviledge to lead it. No one is making you go. If you don’t like it, go somewhere else. I love my church, I am proud of my church AND its leaders, I love thinking that they might get paid well to do what they do, and I thankful that God has made a difference to me and has changed me, softened me, and I want to do the same for others.
I’m going to address some of the issues raised by Changed. Many people have been positively affected by the teaching they heard at Heartland starting first with video teachings from Willow Creek and then getting Mike Breaux after he left Willow Creek. As far as leadership quality is concerned the amount of questions about for profit and not for profit financial handling, discussions about spending on airfares and hotels, the management of the Heartland real estate holdings including tenants at Colonial Village and Heartland house with the in ground pool, outstanding bills owed to businesses and vendors, et al, speak for themselves. These issues came to light when questions were and are still being raised about money management and leadership.
1) Bankord family on staff – I care less about family on staff whether by direct DNA or by marriage to someone else. Nepotism runs rampant in many organizations. It’s a fact of life but it is an affront to many when many good long employed people earning meager salaries are terminated and not because they were hired during the golden years of ministry. Since you brought up the concept of qualifications of individuals on more than one occasion it’s been said that, “Heartland isn’t looking for the best people, we’re looking for the right people.” Guess who said that movie line ripoff?
2) Salaries – To quote Changed, “I don’t know what the leadership at Heartland is paid, but to me, I think the higher the better.” Really? Six figure salaries, Red to Black. $1.5 million. Does this stuff ring a bell? That thinking is so non God honoring. I’ll end that here.
3) Red to Black – Once again, per Changed, “I am thankful for a church that will be as honest as they can be about a situation and ask for help.” That’s the rub. $1.5 million is a lot of money to some people and that usually takes a while to get that far. I get this and so do a lot of others. What we don’t get is past spending practices and that’s just the stuff that’s come out. We can only imagine the stuff we don’t know. The cuts imposed appear way beyond the point to make up $300,000. More businesses and vendors are speaking up and that explains some of the past indebtedness. By the way, Changed, can you share why some leaders prefer to fly only first class or is that part of the “the higher the better” philosophy relating to salaries? Time for the IRS to take notice.
4) Per Changed, “…If you don’t like it, go somewhere else…” Wow, looks like the Holy Huddle is alive and well on South Alpine. The “…go somewhere else” line is usually saved for members who are asking uncomfortable questions to leadership about where the money is going. That’s been the issue from the start. Through this entire string of responses that’s been the basic question. Most people care about the church just as much if not more than you do and they are intelligent enough to know when something does not feel right in their spirit. The truth is going to come out. It’s just a matter of when.
I agree with Dan on many points.
“If you don’t like it, go somewhere else.”, is not Christian and is, in fact, a dishonoring statement towards Christ. The best of you are not better than the least of you.
Is this the Wife of Christ or a Yacht Club?
A true church belongs to the congregation and those employed by the church have salaries set by an impartial church board. The board is unpaid and does it out of honor to Christ.
The comments above make me wonder if this is a church or a business. Mark Bankord is listed as the CEO of Heartland. Really? A church can have a CEO? I did not know that.
What I most ponder since Red to Black is what happens if this entire operation folds? Who’s name is on the paper? Who holds the loans? What happens to Rockford Career College?
Mark Bankord may indeed be worth 6 figures as the organizer of a 8,000 member church with an annual budget of some 8 million dollars. Other members of his family, I don’t think so.
Besides not knowing the salaries of the staff of Heartland, members do not know their responsibilites as well. A true church as ordained clergy that comes visit you in nursing homes and hospitals. They do more than funerals and marriages.
If the leaders of Heartland are honoring God as stewards of offerings made in His name, they will be blessed. However, if they are operating Heartland to look out for themselves and their own before others, they will be cursed. That is Biblical. They need to assess this matter and know that God will as well.
Were I in charge of Heartland, I would let the congregation set my salary and no matter the amount, I would say thank you. If it were too low ($25,000) I would suggest I may not be able to live on that amount but I will give it a try.
Funny how all the mega-church operators seemingly never heard of the concept of a “vow of poverty” in following God and leading others to Him…
Dave – Feel free to ask Mark and/or the entire Board about Heartland’s finances and see how far you get. Heck take someone (as a witness) just for fun, or better yet take a half a dozen with you. Good luck with that. Stand up and let God and the entire congregation be your witnesses and let the truth be known.
What exactly is “A diffent way to do Church”?
We live in a time of great declension for many Reformed churches, a time of toleration for error and syncretism with the surrounding culture. Therefore, we must carefully note and heed the many warnings and imperatives regarding purity of doctrine and false teachers in Scripture (e.g., “note those who cause divisions and offenses, contrary to the doctrine which you learned and avoid them” [Rom. 16:17]; “charge some that they teach no other doctrine” [1 Tim. 1:3]; “guard what was committed to your trust” [1 Tim. 6:20]; “hold fast the pattern of sound words” [2 Tim. 1:13]; “shun idle and profane babblings” [2 Tim. 2:16]; “exhort and convince those who contradict” [Tit. 1:9]; “beware of false prophets” [Mt. 7:15], etc). This point is especially important because there are neo-legalists among us who occupy positions of influence, who subvert whole households and churches with carefully crafted heretical doctrines, with simultaneous affirmations of Reformed truth and dangerous heresies.
It is time for every Reformed believer, every pastor and elder to take a stand for the gospel and fight for the truth. Does not Paul refer to the church as “the pillar and ground of the truth”? (1 Tim. 3:15) Doesn’t this mean that the church has a responsibility to believe, teach, propagate, uphold and obey what God has revealed (the Bible and the whole truth of Christianity including the whole body of inspired precepts and doctrines). Heartland Community Church has a responsibility to keep as a sacred treasure biblical doctrine. She must not modify, ignore, corrupt, add to or detract from the authoritative, unchanging doctrine of Scripture. “The grand test is, does she hold by the truth of God? Is she in her belief and practice a witness for this? Or does she gainsay and pervert it?” One of the church’s most important responsibilities in upholding the truth is warning people regarding false teachers and deviant doctrines. We must continually be on guard against the leaven of the Scribes and Pharisees. May God enable us to faithfully carry the banner of truth in order to preserve our precious covenanted reformation unto future generations. Amen.
It sounds like & what I know this is a place of business {MONEY} instead of a place of worship. Of which will have to be answered for on JUDGEMENT DAY.
Jerold-
You really know your Bible well! Too bad you are a pseudo-intellectual who works with a keyboard in one hand and a thesaurus in the other. You could cherry pick Scripture all day long to make your points and still not make any sense. It’s clear to me that you’re a pastor/teacher wanna-be with no social skills to make a go of it. However, I applaud and respect your passion around this issue. You definitely get an A for effort. Oh, and thanks for ending all your posts in prayer. It really inspires me.
One of many reasons I don’t like the concept of “mega” churches – the secrecy of the budget. At my church, I could call the office and the secretary could immediately give me that information. The entire budget, including salaries is given to the members at pledge time. AND, no one asks me for my W-2. I have heard a church here in town wants that from people. Yikes!
My Final Comment as an (INTP) Active and Involved Member of Heartland Community Church – Amen!
Skeptical -
What is the difference between being intellectual and pseudo-intellectual?
Follow up questions to consider:
What does it mean to be intellectual?
Does being intellectual involve some level of awareness or open-mindedness that isn’t involved in being merely pseudo-intellectual?
How much is intent involved in either being intellectual or pseudo-intellectual? Is a person pseudo-intellectual because they wish to appear intellectual without actually being intellectual?
In an attempt to appear intellectual doesn’t the pseudo-intellectual have an opportunity to become an actual intellectual?
Don’t think you have to answer all of the questions listed above. What I’m trying to tease out here is how much intent is the source and definition of a pseudo-intellectual and how a pseudo-intellectual’s desire to appear intellectual is any different from being an actual intellectual with the same desire.
__________________
As the days go by, we face the increasing inevitability
that we are alone in a godless, uninhabited, hostile
and meaningless universe.
Still, you’ve got to laugh, haven’t you?
I’m pretty sure that Changed and maybe David are truly Bankords or their ‘paid -n -perks’ board members…nice touch spelling the name wrong.
Has anyone contacted the IRS yet? Maybe Heartland should…..they have no secrets as stated by Changed. If any of you know how to conduct an audit, Heartland would be more than willing to let you at any given notice. Just stop in the office ASAP.Then maybe the Rockford Register Star can re-run an article. FOIA should of been applied to ALL Non-profits!!!!!
Jerold,
What is most amusing about atheists is;
When you are really feeling grateful or thankful for how your life is going at any given moment in time, who are you grateful or thankful to? Before you answer, it is not natural to not feel this way from time-to-time, unless, perhaps, you are a prisoner.
Second; If you fail to stick your finger in my electrical outlets at my request caliming you fear the ill affects of electricity, that which you also cannot see, how can you have “faith” that my outlets have any “power”?
On a more serious note: Most atheists I have met are not all that intelligent. They could not work in something like the medical field. Ask any surgeon or surgical nurse to explain to you their experiences whereby they know what intelligent design is and the fact that there is no way the human body can be random as atheists claim.
The Bible holds that for every affliction known to man, God will reveal an answer over time. Funny how that holds true.
Wow, so many opinions! I have always heard that this newspaper was biased, but wow. Maybe many of the readers are biased too and rely on the opinions of others for information. I realize many of you are letting off steam. It’s so sad to read these comments – so negative. Many of you are talking about others – that’s called gossip.
Also, what you are doing in the process is helping other nonbelievers STAY nonbelievers.
Heartland is a good church. Have many of you gone in to talk with someone there? They are transparent. How many of you are relying on the words/opinions of others to get your information?
There are so many issues in these comments. I don’t know where to start. I wish I wouldn’t have even read any of the comments; it was a waste of my time and put a sadness in my heart. Thank you to the commentors who said positive things about Heartland.
Here is another example of Satan attacking people.
I realize that what I’m writing now will fall on deaf ears. People have their minds made up. Their hearts have been hardened.
Actually, Jenny, gossip is when you talk about someone behind their back (good or bad). These people are laying it out on the web in a public forum.
Non-believers stay non-believers because we are often not all on the same page.
Like, for example, when some churches embrace political correctness over Biblical correctness and pretend homosexuality is no longer a sin.
Gossip was not the best word, I guess, for what I was talking about. I think it’s the talking about people – specific names and collectively – that really is sad. My heart grieves when people knock down something or someone, without knowing the complete truth or going to that person/persons they have an issue with (Matthew 18).
I just hope that a lot of people aren’t reading this comment section. People sometimes tend to believe exactly what is written or told by a second or third party. They take that as absolute truth. Go straight to the source.
I wish I wouldn’t have read this comment section. But, I guess people have a right to speak their minds. Just don’t let that information be blackened by hatred and discontent. If you’re not happy with Heartland, go to another church. Other churches have their issues too. It’s just too bad that the media, upset employees, and people that felt unwelcome have to bring just Heartland into the foreground to pick on.
Well, I think some of the attitudes here, myself are not bad.
I tend to be curious like a cat when something catches my eye. I never really thought much about the finances of Heartland until we got into trouble. The 30 year mortgage was not a shocker to me but the refinancing every 5 years was.
Then, that got me to wondering; What if this operation folds? Who’s name is on the papers, Mark’s? Is it really his church rather than His church?
The idea that Mark Bankord is paid a 6 figure salary did not concern me, the fact that his entire family may also be on the payroll does.
As for me, I am hoping for change in November of 2012. None of these conversations would be happening in a sound economy. Right now, people are scared. Right now, people are angry with those at the top taking advantage of those in the middle and at the bottom.
I hope Heartland continues on. The good that church does for the area is truly amazing.
just got home from the Heartland baptism/communion service. Over 120 people publicly professed their faith in Jesus in front of over 1,000 witnesses. Truly a celebration.
So you might have an opinion you have formed about an individual based on hearsay, gossip and incomplete information. Or you might have had an encounter that left your feathers ruffled. But you cannot say that the Holy Spirit is being quenched at that church.
Imagine what might happen if it was led well?
Jenny- How old are you? You obviously have no idea what is true or you do and choose to ignore it. You referred to this as another example of satan attacking people. Have you not heard that satan masquerades as an angel of light?? I can tell you first hand that most of these posts that you call gossip is true. I heard this directly from leadership. Pastor Mike is a great motivational speaker. I just don’t think that is what Jesus said his Church should be built on. Empty feel good speeches produce one thing, larger offerings. You need to educate yourself about the way churches use marketing techniques to trick their followers into giving them money. Jesus said to the rich young ruler to sell ALL his possessions and give the money to the poor…not the church. This is what he was referring to about material wealth. His love in unconditional and free. His salvation HAS been paid for. I don’t know and do not want to know the Jesus Heartland refers to. A Jesus that justifies spending money on a great light show to impress shallow people who demand it over keeping a single mother employed. Jesus from the New Testament tells me true religion is providing for widows and orphans. I pray you get to know Jesus too.
Here’s teh way it ;ooks to me: the “leadership” at Heartland is a tightly infused group. Lots of similar names, overlapping roles, and secrecy. Hope I’m wrong but I don’t think so. It looks as thoughperhaps Mr. Bankord parlayed his talent for making a high income in the investment world into securing high incomes for himself and his family (and investord??) in Heartland. Clearly the leadership at Heartland sees itself as uquestionable. They need to open the books and come clean. Probably revising all sorts f financials right now… hope not, but a strong gut feeling. Or maybe they just got caufgt up in the church’s success and put themsleves in front of God. It’s happened before.
Joyce-
Did you sell your possessions and give your money to the poor? How many widows and orphans did you provide for this year? Your hypocrisy shines through your typed words. Most poor people choose to be poor and rely on others to provide for them. Please look in the mirror and conduct a self-assessment before you reply and ask how “old” people are.
Skeptical: exactly what do you mean by “most poor people choose to be poor and rely on others to provide for them.” That is a very audacious and, shall I say, judgemental statement. What does the bible say about judging others?
LuLu,
I think the Bible says a lot about judging others and that it’s bad. By the way, I have never been called audacious before. Bodacious, loquacious and hellacious yes. But never audacious, thanks!
Some of these comments are truly sad. I worked for the Rockford Rescue Mission for many years and not all poor people are that way because of laziness. Some fell into adictions because their bodies can crave substances, like alcohol, more than most of us. Some are mentall off and were turned out on the streets thanks to the ACLU who claimed to be looking out for their right to free association. Some just are at the worng place at the wrong time. We should all do more to help those who have less than us. It is what Jesus would want us to do. Heartland does a great job of teaching us that and showing us ways to do that.
Jenny- Your comment is typical Heartland’s teaching, you totally missed the point. Jesus gift of salvation is free…..why do some churches still sell it. And yes I did help feed orphans and widows this year…it just didn’t make it in the paper.
Skeptical, please read my statement again. I was NOT calling you audacious (I don’t know you). I was calling your statement audacious, which means “Showing an impudent lack of respect” according to Dictionary.com. I hope your post about poor people was meant to be a joke. My neighbors are “poor.” One lost a job and the other has major health problems. On top of that, they have no health insurance. They are about ready to lose their home. Do you think people choose to be like this?
I read through these comments and see this 8000 number thrown about for membership. As a past seat counter or should I say empty seat counter I sincerely doubt there are 8000 members and please don’t mix up members with just people who attend. I’ve worked a lot of weekends and with four services they are hardly ever full. I’d say maybe around 3000 to 5000 for an average weekend. Nobody knows an exact number for members because people become members and then leave. I don’t think Heartland knows how many members have left the church. After going there for a while you learn to take the numbers they give up front with a grain of salt. As far as finding out where the money goes, good luck with that.
Lulu,
I don’t think people choose to be like that. Hard times fall on all of us and it takes nice people helping others to get us all back on our feet after a fall. Poor people don’t choose to be poor. Some just choose to stay poor and that frustrates me. That’s what I was trying to say. Thank you for challenging my comment.
I still go to Heartland but I’m certainly not going to give any more money to the church until they get their act together and I mean really walk the talk. I’ve read through the comments and even did my own asking around church with people and volunteers I know and there appears to be a lot of validity about the extravegance and how money is spent. The six figure salaries, airfares for staff people (and yes, even the preference to fly first class), the Heartland house in a nice section of town with the inground pool, deep sea fishing in the Gulf of Mexico, some staff joking to part timers and volunteers about their “housing allowances”, the firing of all those employees and yet they hire for the for profit Monvee venture and I wonder how much debt is there, really? It goes on and on. The numbers don’t make sense but that’s another thing. I know people on First Impressions who are the greeters and count attendance and they chuckle when they hear those on stage rattle off numbers they know are way off. They have their own name for that. If management came from the private money sector they know exactly what they’re doing. This isn’t just a mistake. It’s intentional and it looks like whatever they were or are doing with the money backfired on them? Blame the economy? Spare me. Here is the big question I have for management and even the board that HAS to know what’s going on when they look at the spending, “How do you sleep at night?” How do you sleep at night knowing about the lack of God honoring oversight of the resources that have been entrusted to you when some people are giving their last $10 or $15 for the week. You people need to get down on your knees and beg forgiveness for what you have done. Unfortunately, the pride issue in the yacht club is running rampant and I don’t see that happening anytime soon. Somebody whether it’s The Rockford Register Star, The Chicago Tribune, the IRS, or whomever needs to do some digging and find out the truth so there can be accountability and let the chips fall where they may.
The weekend where Mike Breaux spoke about why bad things happen to good people totally shocked and appalled me. He sited of all sorts of great reasons (the fall/collective bad of all humans, etc.) but he never once dared mentioned the name of Satan (way too scary). Of course that makes total sense because Heartland follows the false teaching of Bill Hybel (Seeker Sensitive Movement). If you are still a Heartlander and reading this please do a little research for yourself and test it against the true word of God, the Bible. Do a search on Bill Hybel, Joel Osteen, Rick Warren, and Oprah. Whether or not you care about how much Mark Bankord and his family make, you should most certainly care about if what is preached from their stage is Biblical or not. “A Different Way To Do Church” is fundamentally wrong. Misleading the masses… someday they will stand before God.
I have two clients who are owed money by Heartland and I ‘ve previously advised them to try and work things out for payment. That’s not working. I’ve spoken to some of my friends in the industry and I hear the same from them for some of their clients. Now I understand some payroll checks may have bounced. It sounds like Heartland might be headed for a reorganization or bankruptcy.
Check out what’s going on at Crystal Cathedral Church in California. There are similarities with Heartland. Both have major financial problems. Both have their top people getting hefty salaries. Both have questionable money management. Creditors are suing the California church for a “breach of fiduciary responsibilities.”
Jeff brings up an interesting point. Civil litigation requires a different standard of proof, that being “a preponderance of the evidence” or is it more likely than not that the plantiff has made the case, e.g. Goldman v. Simpson (Cal. Ct. App. – Feb. 20, 2008). If an allegation can be made that the church breached its fiduciary responsibilities with its poor spending habits then there appears to be a strong case with that standard. Of course, depositions of staff (past and present), a review of the church finances going back several years, and an assessment of all properties and relationships can give a clear picture. Worst case scenario is that the civil case uncovers criminal (state and/or federal) violations. Then it gets real interesting. Just a reminder, Martha Stewart did not go to prison for insider trading. She went to prison for lying to investigators.
Luther’s Boy, really? That wasn’t funny and has been reported.
The comment has been deleted.
The minute they start putting bookstores, cafes, and fast food restaurants inside their ‘church’, I’m gone. How can they go on teaching God’s Word and drive around town in huge gas-sucking SUVs and live in multi-million dollar homes? It just never made that much sense to me!
Intereting interview from April, 2008 with Mark Bankord. Love the last part…Two ways you can fired from the church
http://churchexecutive.com/archives/mark-bankord-directional-leader-heartland-community-church-rockford-il
I love heartland; but clearly it doesn’t take a genius to figure that there was “rich man’s” club within the staff. How can you knowingly take someones last $$$s for the week and then go home and live like a king and queen. Is this what Jesus did. I am not surprised by any of this and I beleive they have just touched the surface relative to the greed in this church. All that being said many people have been save that might not have been. Many have been brought to church that might never have gone. I will leave the judgement to God. And to Mark… if you really love Jesus as you say you do then lead by example and live as he had lived. He did not saturate himself in wordly goods, he did not accept an enormous salary, really an ingroud pood at the Hearland house… because of that I could never have been your follower! You may have saved many – but you lost many as well.
STOP! In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, just stop. This is the Rockford Register Star News Paper not Heartland Community Church web sight for God’s sake. We desperately need our children more now then ever to go back to church and find God. This is putting RED flags over every church door in their eyes as evil, corrupt and run by a few out for themselves. This is not the church image anyone wants. Take these questions to your leaders for answers and fix the problem with in, without turning everyone against God’s house. Please people think about it. And no I am not a member of this church.
This comment site is really scary and is not in any way God-honoring. Jesus said that others will know we are His disciples by our love for each other. It sounds to me like most of the comments here are submitted by people who have been turned off by the lack of love and respect for each other in the body of Christ. The true church is not a church building, big or small. The true church is made up of people who have surrendered their lives to Jesus Christ, not someone who goes to a certain church. I think a lot of folks need to get on their knees instead of on this site, and get their hearts right with God, so the words they share honor Jesus Christ and His church in Rockford!!
The Fall of The American Christian Church will be facilitated by the overwhelming arrogance of its own people.
Please note that 12-13 more staff from Heartland have been released due to the crumbling finances of the church. Perhaps they are trying to turn things around, but why did it take so long? And, why do the leaders that allowed it to happen still remain on staff, the board, and as elders? Why is one of the elders normally a volunteer position getting a salary? Still so much work to be done.
I have been waiting and watching to see if there might be some outcry from the Register Star but I see none. It appears that our local newspaper agrees with what has affected thousands of people in the Rockford area or they just don’t care. In a more recent article with the departure of the top dog was written by someone with ties to the church. Probably not a very ethical move on the paper’s part. The RRS really jumped in to support Sharefest but did nothing to investigate the money situation with previous Sharefests, who got paid, who didn’t, and where did all the money go from the store Sharestuff that people were told originally the money from the store would go to Sharefest. Check that one out. Million Meals for Haiti? Did everyone get paid for that? The spiritual development program Monvee has proven to be a trainwreck. Where is the company now? Guess who was listed as CEO of that one? Since John Ortberg’s name is all over it I’m curious if he really knew what was going on with Monvee. Maybe someone just forgot to clue him in. Ask about salaries at Heartland past and present and let’s see how far you get. I’ve been to the church a few times in the past when Mike Breaux was there a lot. Now that he’s the main teaching guy living in another state and his family on the west coast I’m curious how much longer he is going to stay around. I keep on bumping into former Heartlanders all over. The one positive thing that seems to be common? They all know what a church is NOT supposed to be like. Thanks Mark. Nice job.